This week the Good Men Project has run two stories about men who rape. The first was written by a friend of the rapist, a man who violated an acquaintance after she passed out at a party. The second was a first-person account by a man who says he’s raped a lot of women and expects to rape again.
The author of the first of these pieces says she wrote it because “no one is taking responsibility for the mixed messages about sex and sexuality in which we are stewing,” and the editor who approved the second says that “this anonymous rapist’s essay has held a mirror up to us, and it blazes with the news: here are the symptoms of our dysfunctional culture.”
But these justifications don’t hold water. These guys aren’t raping because of society’s mixed messages, and giving a rapist a platform doesn’t hold up a mirror to society.
Why? Because most people aren’t rapists. Most men aren’t rapists. In fact, most asshole men aren’t rapists. The data on this is pretty clear. The vast majority of rapes are committed by a small number of men, and the main reason so many people are raped is that those few men rape over and over again, mostly with impunity.
When right-thinking people talk about rape we tend to talk a lot about the importance of understanding how consent works. “No means no” and “yes means yes” and “enthusiastic consent.” And that’s all important stuff to talk about. It’s vital.
But it’s also vital to remember that when folks get their wires crossed about what each of them is looking for, rape isn’t usually the outcome. Far more often it’s discomfort or awkwardness or going home annoyed because someone who seemed nice turned out to be kind of a jerk.
That’s because most of the time, when someone’s not into something, their partner picks up on it. Maybe not immediately, but soon. And when they realize it, they stop. Because they don’t want to rape anybody.
Rapists don’t stop. Rapists don’t stop when the person they’ve been flirting with passes out — not because they don’t understand that an unconscious person can’t consent to sex, but because they don’t care. Rapists don’t stop when they realize someone is tensing up, or pushing them away, or drifting off, or crying, or saying no.
They don’t stop because they don’t want to stop.
So yes, let’s continue to have conversations about the ways that the sexual negotiation model of man as pursuer and woman as gatekeeper can lead to ugliness and confusion. Let’s continue to have conversations about the ways that intentions can get blurry in the presence of alcohol and drugs. Let’s continue to have conversations about how to get everyone on the same page without breaking the mood. About how to listen, how to speak up, how to check in. About how to deliver and respond to a rebuff graciously.
But let’s have those conversations among decent people.
Let’s leave the rapists out of it.
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December 13, 2012 at 12:12 pm
Patrick
Without disagreeing with the central arguments here. I do think that the dysfunctional elements of culture do lead to more rapists than would exist in a less dysfunctional culture . I believe that culture is part of how the rapists end up as people who don’t care about consent, rather than that all rapists are born bad. I don’t discount the idea that inborn factors are relevant, and that is of course an empirical question, but I’d be very surprised if culture wasn’t a factor.
That doesn’t mean I want to have this discussion with rapists though. This is a forward looking concern. It’s about how the future could have less rapists and therefore less rape.
December 13, 2012 at 12:18 pm
Angus Johnston
I completely agree with that, Patrick, and thanks for saying it. When I wrote that society’s mixed messages aren’t why people rape, I meant that rapists aren’t — in the main — raping because of confusion or incomplete information about consent. But yes, culture is part of how rapists become rapists.
One interesting (and encouraging) datapoint on that — rape rates in the United States are down by 88% since 1973. There are a lot of reasons for that (some of which I discuss in this post: https://studentactivism.net/2010/12/24/feminism-works/) but the upshot is that feminist legal, judicial, and cultural interventions have had a huge impact on reducing rape rates.
And that’s one of the reasons it’s so upsetting to see the GMP folks attacking feminists over their analysis of this stuff — because if there’s one thing we know, it’s that feminism is extraordinarily effective in combatting rape.
December 13, 2012 at 1:24 pm
MediaHound
Angus I have to say I am on side or in parallel with so much you have said. there can be quibbles, but your a reasonable guy and the quibbles are more about ripples rocking a boat, not big waves making it ship water or even capsize.
BUT…. (Couldn’t you see that one coming).. when you say “Let’s leave the rapists out of it.” you actually reverse your whole position. It has been the work of people in discussion with rapists over some 40 years that has developed the understanding you trumpet about only a few men being the majority rapists.
I may not be fond of rapists, and sure don’t intend to have any over for dinner – but I do have to be grateful to both the Researchers and The Rapists who have been working on the issues and “Let’s leave the rapists out of it.” would siply have made any progress less valid.
You even dismiss the work of people like Loretta Ross, Yulanda Ward and Nkenge Toure of the DC rape Crisis centre and William Fuller and Larry Cannon of “Prisoners Against Rape Inc” who trail blazed the very subject and actually started to unpick the Gordian Knot by asking the questions – why?
You may not be familiar with these people – they were the central motivation around the creation of a film that was filmed in 1974 and released January 1975. The film was of course called “Rape Culture”.
I’m amazed at how many folks use the term and know so little about it, where it comes from, what it has facilitated and even changed and how it would not have existed if it was not for some brave folks who ignored convention and did something impressive and now ignored.
December 13, 2012 at 1:42 pm
Angus Johnston
Absolutely agreed with all of that, MH. When I say “I don’t want to discuss consent with rapists,” I mean that literally — I don’t want to do it. And when I use the implied plural at the end, I’m talking about folks like me and GMP and the lay feminist blogosphere — people whose work is talking rather than researching.
I linked above to a discussion some of the research you mentioned, and I do think it’s incredibly valuable. But that’s a different kind of writing, and a different kind of “we,” than the one I’m discussing in this post.
Thanks for the response, and the chance to clarify.
August 29, 2013 at 3:02 pm
Sean
I was hoping you could comment on something for me. I’ve been having this issue of confusion in my personal life where again and again I am told by women something along the lines of “talking about if they want to have sex or not is a turn off, real men just take confidently. Women just want to give in too total overpowering male desire.” Which to me is a conflicting message… if I can break that apart a bit. These women are saying that 1.) It is a turn on to be just taken by pure lust, intense desire. 2.) They don’t want any discussion about it in advance and CERTAINLY not a question. 3.) They don’t think it is very manly to discuss consent, especially when posed as a question. Add in the fairly common existence of the “rape fantasy” and you get a pretty confusing mixed bag there.
As a male who doesn’t intend to be a rapist I find this all very confusing. Also, very detrimental to my sex life in general. I have these two conflicting ideas in my head and have become at least slightly bewildered by how to proceed. I don’t know if it is just consistently meeting the wrong women or what but this seems to keep coming up. So how does one, “take confidently. Show overpowering desire.” yet still get proper consent. I also have met at least two women who have admitted that saying “no” but having the guy move past that no is “the hottest thing ever” to them. I was curious about that and discussed it further with them, obviously it is only ok when they actually desire the guy and “the guy should know the difference”
I feel like a lot of this centers around the different ways we communicate but I get the impression from exploring this concept with women that they expect us to be able to read their minds and act accordingly.
i guess I’m just curious what your thoughts are on my current dilemma.
August 29, 2013 at 5:30 pm
Angus Johnston
Sean, I have a few responses to this question.
First, the desire to be “taken” in the way that you describe is by no means universal, even as a fantasy. There are lots of women who would find what you’re describing a total turnoff, even in a safe, controlled environment.
Second, there are ways to be mindful of consent and mutuality without stopping to ask direct, literal questions. Responsiveness to a partner’s non-verbal cues is as much a part of consent as explicit discussion, and even verbal communication can be handled in a way that doesn’t take you out of the moment.
Having said that, though, if you’re not sure that the subtle thing is working — if you’re not sure that it’s giving you the information you need to be sure that consent is present — then you absolutely have to slow down until you have that information.
Because what we’re talking about here is the consequences of being wrong. If you’re with someone and you’re overly concerned with consent the worst that can happen is sex that’s a bit less fun, or no sex at all. If you’re not paying enough attention to consent the worst that can happen is sexual assault. I know which direction I’d rather be making my mistakes in, and which direction I’d encourage you to go in too.
Finally, and in all honesty, if a woman told me she wanted me to disregard her “no” and just take her, I’d tell her that that’s exactly why safewords were invented.
When someone says she wants you to ignore her explicitly stated request that you stop doing something, and she refuses to give you the tools to do that in a way that ensures to your satisfaction that enthusiastic consent exists, she’s asking you to do something unethical. It’s okay to be uncomfortable with that. It’s appropriate to be uncomfortable with that. And just as you would listen and respond accordingly when your partners tell you that they don’t want to do something, it’s their responsibility to show you the same respect.
If a woman asks you to disregard her “no,” it’s absolutely okay for you to respond to that request with a “no” of your own. And “no,” as we all know by now, means “no.”
August 30, 2013 at 3:51 pm
meoskop
Sean,
I wrote you a long reply & wordpress lost it. Trying again.
Your post is setting off Nice Guy alarms in that you group “women” together as though they are one thing and not individuals, you claim confusion over what women want is somehow keeping you from having maximum sex and you represent a view that is by no means compatible with the views I hear actual women express as a majority.
Either you are very young or you are a Nice Guy. If it’s the latter, I can’t help you. If it’s the former, stop viewing these women as potential sex partners. If a woman tells you that a man “should know when to push past no” run very far away from her. If a woman says “Yes, I would like to have sex with you and this is what I prefer in my partner” then do as Angus suggested and set up safe words. If a woman says “I would have sex with you but by asking me you made me not desire you” stop and verify you are dealing with a woman and not a unicorn.
There is nothing in the world that women collectively want sexually except the ability to freely choose or not choose their partners. Choice and consent are the only universal truths about female sexuality. Women with non consent fantasies are interested in role playing non consent with a partner they have chosen, not a random dudebro they know. Women may discuss sexuality in general terms when asked. These are not instructions. These are conversations.
Nothing a woman does inhibits your sex life. Either you are finding people who wish to have sex with you or you are not. Women are not sex dispensers and can find being seen that way very uninteresting. Pursue women you desire. Take no for an answer. Take I don’t know as a no. Take YES as a signal that the sexual preferences of this woman may be relevant to your sex life. The preferences of women not saying YES to sex with you are moot. They are not relevant. You need not concern yourself with that data.